Transcript: Sokoman Minerals (SIC) - Local Newfoundlander Chasing Gold
Interview with Timothy Froude, President & CEO of Sokoman Minerals. Sokoman Minerals Corp. is a discovery-oriented company with projects in Newfoundland & Labrador, Canada. The Company's primary focus is its portfolio of gold projects: Moosehead, Crippleback Lake (optioned to Trans Canada Gold Corp.) and East Alder (optioned to Canterra Minerals Corporation) along the Central Newfoundland Gold Belt, and the recently acquired district-scale Fleur de Lys project in northwestern Newfoundland that is targeting Dalradian-type orogenic gold mineralization similar to the Curraghinalt and Cavanacaw deposits in Northern Ireland.
Through recent acquisitions with Benton Resources Inc. (50/50 JV), Sokoman controls one of the largest land holdings in Newfoundland with over 150,000 hectares (1,500 km2) of highly prospective ground in Canada's newest and rapidly emerging gold districts.
- 02:30 - Company Overview
- 03:36 - Market Buzz Around Newfoundland
- 06:13 - 2018 to Present: What Did Sokoman Set Out to Do?
- 08:18 - Tim Froude's Background
- 09:21 - Who Else is on the Team?
- 11:03 - Why did Sokoman Choose Their Projects?
- 15:30 - How do Sokoman Balance Playing the Market & Delivering Their Quota?
- 22:34 - How're Sokoman Going About Drilling?
- 25:46 - How is $50M Being Deployed?
- 29:48 - Sokoman Minerals' Delivery Capability
Matthew Gordon: Tim, how are you sir?
Timothy Froude: I'm just fine this morning, Matthew. Thanks for having me.
Matthew Gordon: Well, I'm glad you're on the show. We've had a flurry of Newfoundland based companies recently, delighted to have you on. You're from that part of the world, aren’t you?
Timothy Froude: Actually, believe it or not, I'm sitting in my hometown, which is only 15-minutes’ drive from our flagship Moosehead property. I mean, it's so funny, you spend your whole geological career chasing these things all over the planet and here I am back in my own backyard. So it has come full circle and it's nice, actually to spend some time with family.
Matthew Gordon: Brilliant, and I'm thinking you're gonna know where the good stuff is, that's what I'm hoping.
Timothy Froude: Well, I think we got some good stuff. We've been here since mid-2018, and have pulled some pretty good holes. And I hate to think that we started it all, we're part of it. But we were certainly one of the initial, high-grade sort of deliverers here in this rapidly emerging central Newfoundland Gold belt, right?
Matthew Gordon: Oh boy, people are excited. Like, it's like a circus is in town, there's a lot of people setting up camp, a lot of newbies, excited for that, is it good for you?
Timothy Froude: For sure, we've always looked to central Canada or the Golden Triangle in BC, kind of nice to have an area play like that sort of thing. That area plays per se is the thing, I mean, to actually be delivering results to the market, in addition to having a lot of interest here, the spotlight is here for a change. And as I mentioned in our talk previously, this is not something we were used to here. We're used to people coming here for Iron-ore, Nickel, Oil, whatever, Gold is a new thing here. I always tell people, I think Newfoundland is where Timmons was in 1910, our golden age is just starting.
Matthew Gordon: Beautiful. I'm looking forward to hearing the story. But first, give us that 1-minute overview of the business for people new to this story, including myself, I guess, and I'll pick it up from there with some questions.
Timothy Froude: We're a Newfoundland based and focused and almost entirely staffed exploration company. We're a discovery driven company, we want to make that find and build that momentum up to the takeover, sort of thing. We won't be miners ourselves, we're explorers, it's what we do best, my 30-year career has been basically exploration and that's something I think that people need to take away from this is that, we know this area very well, yes we were stagnant maybe, if you want to call us that for a little bit at the outset, with just 1 project, but we've been watching what's been happening here in Central and we've watched companies come and make their big play and stuff, but now they have to deliver. We've been delivering for 2-years, we've also padded our property portfolio as well. And with the $15M Treasury right now, we're well financed to move all of our projects, including our new ones forward.
Matthew Gordon: Yeah. Well, actually, I joked earlier about a circus being in town and by that, I meant that Newfoundland is the buzzword of the mining, you can sort of see it coming from pre-Christmas to now, but it is good news for people like you who have been cash constrained. It has allowed you to get some cash in the coffers and start doing things that you wanted to be doing a while ago.
Timothy Froude: Well, I mean, yeah, we've always looked at programmes in terms of 5000m drill programme or 10,000m programme. Well, phase 6, which is what we're currently in right now started in September, it’s a 10,000m programme. We had $2.5M, maybe $3M in the bank. We kept delivering the results and we decided, we just gotta make this thing bigger, especially with the elephant in the room just to the east of us. I mean, with the 200,000m programme, I mean, that's a programme right, 10,000m, 15,000m. So, we decided to basically just take the bull by the horns and we doubled the programme late last year to 20,000m. Earlier this year, we took it to 50,000m and we can even take it beyond that. The only issue we have now is basically logistics in terms of drills and people and personnel but you know what, you have to take the good with the bad. It's nice that the spotlight is here in Newfoundland right now and we're enjoying it. And yes, I do welcome other explorers. We do want to have multiple discoveries here. We just don't want to be a one project wonder. And so with our current Treasury, our staff, all local people, we know where we need to put our hammers and our drills.
Matthew Gordon: Okay, I want to come on to that actually because being a local boy, that's kind of the bit that interests me. You raised an interesting point there that it's all well and good being able to get money now but the cost of everything else has probably gone up, the competition for resources has gone up.
Timothy Froude: Oh, absolutely. We’ve publicly stated we want 50,000m finished by the end of the year with at least 4 drills. We still have just the 2. Now, we have been told by our contractor that a 3rd one is on the way, but again they're waiting for parts and things 6-10-weeks, 12-weeks delays for parts. It's getting to the point where you're cobbling together drills, just to get them on the ground, and then you have to find people and that's also a challenge. In fact, as I mentioned, to you for a few days there a little while ago, we had 1 shift on our drill because the night shift quit to go to company B, because of a slightly higher bonus pay or whatever so it's getting to that, I mean, it's almost a wild west here but you know it's fun I guess.
Matthew Gordon: Nice problems to have. Let's go back to the beginning, you are a local boy, we’ve established that and you talked about from 2018, you've been at it for the last 2, 2.5-years. So what did you set out to try and do and I appreciate it, it's been a tough 2.5-years but the last 6-months have really kind of changed things a lot. So, what was it like in 2018 and what were you trying to do?
Timothy Froude: Well, basically, we had a pickup truck and myself and my main field guy, and that was that was it pretty much. We didn't even have a field office. So we've come a long way and right now we have a full time staff of 7. Our budget for this year is gonna be about $8M when you look at all of our projects combined. And so we started out pretty small and so with our very first hole at Moosehead, we cut 11.9m at 45g and then the phone rang, and it kept ringing. From there, we've just been able to go along for the ride, if you will, but not just that, I mean, we haven't just lived off 1 hole. Every phase to date, we've delivered. I can't really use the word in a press release, but I will use it here, Bonanza grades. We're chasing the gem of the gems in terms of Gold deposits, the Fosterville mine in Australia, the flagship operation of Gold, we see many similarities to that, as to our neighbours, Newfound Gold, I mean, we're exploring basically the same base that they are. They just happened to be on the east side and we're on the west side. And major structures again, key here. So it almost doesn't seem like 2.5-years but we're still here and we took the property from a 1 zone property to 5 zones now and they're all open. We have a lot of work to do here yet and that's my mission basically, is to make every one of those zones either bigger or make them all one which ultimately you want to do.
Matthew Gordon: What's your background in all of this?
Timothy Froude: I'm a geologist, I was born and raised here and went to school in St. John's, got my BSc in geology there. I've worked for several companies, most geologists do. I started with Inco limited, and that's been 11-years with them. And then a handful of juniors since then, and I joined this company probably 13 or 14-years ago. I'm not a founder of the company, I'm the longest serving employee of the company, but I'm not a founder. I did come on as VP of exploration and over time worked my way to the position I am now. I much prefer to be in the field a bit more but there's also important jobs to be doing outside of the field, like what I'm doing here with you right now, getting our message out. I love talking about this project, because it's, well, our bread and butter. And I think, at least 2 or 3 of the hurdles that you want, if you want to go to the long end of the term of the race, the endgame but we obviously still have a lot of work to do here.
Matthew Gordon: Okay, so you're an explorer, you're a geologist, who else is on the team?
Timothy Froude: Well, I have a VP Exploration who spent probably half of his career defining the Voisey's Bay deposits in Labrador. And he's also had quite a bit of experience with Gold here in New Newfoundland. In fact, one of our new acquisitions called Golden Hope, Lee is his name, he spent several years down there exploring and developing that resource down there. We have probably some of the best prospectors in Newfoundland and some of them are actually relatives, part of the clan if you want to call them the clan, the clan that basically won the Bill Dennis prospect of the year award several years ago and directly responsible for what Newfoundland has out there. So, we're all explorers, in fact, I broke the first piece of rock that had Gold in at Valentine Lake, which is Marathon’s project that will probably be the next mine here in Newfoundland. So, we're proven, we're working in our backyard, we're working very efficiently, very effectively. We probably have the lowest burn rate of any company in the country. All our money goes a long way here, I mean, are all-in costs, pre-COVID, including assaying per metre was under $130 a metre. Compare that to other jurisdictions where the logistics are more challenging west and stuff, but your dollars go a long way here. And as well, we have a very supportive government, their mission is to put 5 new mines on the map before 2030. I'm going to help them as much as I can in that goal.
Matthew Gordon: But I think the dollar did go a long way, I think the prices are probably going to go up a little bit. But talk to me about the home boy component here, which is you've been around here for about 18-years, you’ve been involved in this company for 18-years is that what you said to me?
Timothy Froude: Pretty close to that.
Matthew Gordon: So in terms of the land packages that you've got, because we've seen so many of these companies just being created or assets being acquired in Newfoundland of recent times, because you can see this coming, 6-9-months ago, and they're gonna have picked up what was around, you've been around longer, you've picked up your projects because why? Why did you go for that versus all the other opportunities that you had?
Timothy Froude: Well, Moosehead was clearly our focus. When you acquire a project, like Moosehead which did have a past prior to our arrival, they had a 20-year history prior to we acquiring the property in 2018 and high-grade was identified. You just can't let go of that, and our project as well doesn't have any outcrop on it, which is a challenge again. A lot of the projects that you hear about right now, our neighbours, in fact, many of their best Gold zones are actually exposed so they had a chance to stand on them and look at them and figure out, well, maybe we need to drill this way, sort of thing. We didn't have that opportunity here. So, our focus and our mission was to take the Moosehead project and turn it into an asset, not just a money pit. So as I mentioned we acquired this project with just 1 really defined zone of mineralization. In 2018, we drilled a hole in what we now call our Eastern trends. It's become our largest zone, it’s still open. We've watched the others come in, not to say that I know where all the Gold is in Newfoundland by any stretch, but I've been on a lot of those other grounds. Some of it is good, and there will be other discoveries made. In fact, I hope there will be but there's more in Newfoundland than central Newfoundland in terms of Gold. Newfoundland has a very complex geological and structural history that has created multiple opportunities. In fact, from west to east, there's probably 4 or 5 major crustal structures that have Gold associated with them. A lot of people think it's just a 1 trend, the Newfound trend but that's not the case. I mean, we sit on a parallel trend to Newfound that also has 2 of Newfoundland’s most significant Gold prospects. I mean, Marathon probably has 5Moz of Gold. We sit directly on that trend, people seem to forget that. There's 5Moz right there just to the south east of us, the southwest of us. Beyond that, on the same fault, Matador mining, they're rapidly advancing the Cape Ray project, north of Moz on that. So, 0oz, on the other side of the hill with all due respect to their drill results, 6Moz plus on the fault that we're on. So where would you rather be? Would you rather follow the sheet and just say you're tied on to company X, so local people, where else, what have people missed here. So, another company that is very proud to be associated with Benton Resources, Stephen Stares, and I got together just recently and said, there are other opportunities here. So, we have to just not sit by and watch everybody come in and say they've got the best round and we know there are opportunities. So we staked 3 very large projects. In fact, with Moosehead and our recent joint ventures with Benton, we now control, we're not the largest, everybody says we’re the largest ship in Newfoundland, I don't care about that. All I care about is the quality of the asset. So we now have north of 150,000ha of ground, more than 6000 claims. It makes us a large land holder but to me, it doesn't matter if I'm first or 15th; what I care about is the quality of the assets, and we're just getting going on some of our new assets. So, you'll be hearing about us on multiple fronts.
Matthew Gordon: That’s why I was interested in this conversation. In fact I interviewed a CEO last week, he said, well, with the Newfoundland narrative going on, it's gonna be easy to go and raise capital. And with that capital, I can maybe do some drilling, and maybe I'll get lucky, I don't know, there's no certainty to it, there never is with mining. But at the same time, he was really clear, I’m playing the market and there's a way to play the market, and timing is everything. And yeah, at some point, I'm going to have to deliver, I don't know if I can do that but maybe I can. I'll certainly have the money to be able to try. You're saying to me, it’s a more fundamental story, like, I think I know where the good stuff is and I think I know what good looks like and I think I understand some of these faults and some of these trends, and I'm gonna pick up the right stuff. So it's a little bit more confidence in what you're saying. And it's not a market game and maybe that's part of the upside or maybe part of the downside in the sense that you've also got to play both sides. You got to play the market a little bit and you've also got to deliver. So, I mean, how do you position yourself? Do you think that as explorers and geologists, you'd want to do things the right way? Or are you cognizant that the market also needs to be understood?
Timothy Froude: Well, clearly, Newfound have done a wonderful job. They tied up a very nice packaging ground, they've marketed it exquisitely sort of thing, but do you know what, we were here before them, you know, Eric Sprott, and I'm not saying we were his very first, because I don't know what was going on with him before he met us but we brought Eric Sprott to Newfoundland. Moosehead was known long before Keats became what it is right now. So, you know, we've been there, we've done that thing. We put our nose to the grindstone and said, okay, here we go, this is our opportunity, let’s take this thing because I really believe this project has potential now to be more than just an exploration. We've continued to deliver substantial results, I mean, if you look at recent drill intercepts for the province and someone recently sent me a short spreadsheet showing the top 100 drill holes. Of the 20 top drill holes, 17 of them belong to us and Newfound, I forget what the score is, maybe they're 10 to 7 or something like that. But we've been there so we've got the goods. And this would probably be on me, where I'm a geologist, maybe a geologist is not the best person to run an exploration company, but we're an exploration company, so maybe I should be but the marketing is getting there, we've increased our budget for that tremendously. We're at all-time highs. I'd like to stay there and I do believe we're still undervalued, when you look at some of our peers, and what they've got in their basket and what we've got in our basket. Sometimes it doesn't make sense, but it's an area play and these things happen, right? If they all get money and they're able to at least make an attempt to get what we have, what we found and what we've delivered, well, then, they probably deserve to be there. But I still think, there's room for us to be a little bigger in terms of market cap, yes. I used to lose a lot of sleep over that, I used to get a lot of emails and things like that. I know what my job is, is to keep delivering results and ignore the chaff and just go for the wheat. It's my job to explore.
Matthew Gordon: Okay, so you said earlier, I ask the question, rhetorically, do you want to be a sheep, do you want to follow the storyline that's there at the moment. No, I don't, I want to, because I'm not confident about being able to play or game the market in terms of work out where someone's going to get to before in your words ‘has to deliver’. I want good strong fundamentals here so I do buy what you’re saying on that front. So let's talk about some things that you're doing because you mentioned with Moosehead, look like a one trick pony, but you've gone and done this deal with Benton now, which I guess gives you some good optionality. So you got a couple of projects then but you've also optioned out one of your other projects, Crippleback, I think as well. So you're starting to look at the portfolio, you're understanding that you need to do that.
Timothy Froude: Yes, that's right. Well, we've actually done 2 deals in the past couple of months for a couple of our projects that we've basically had before. Well, we had them before Moosehead, so I mean, they're acquired at a good time when real estate was a lot cheaper and we were able to get good projects, both East Alder which we've optioned to Canterra. And Crippleback, to Trans Canada Gold. Both lie on the same structure that we're on with Marathon. So that's the first major box for me is, where it is in terms of structure, you have to be on a structure, you're not gonna get Gold and rocks that don't have structure unless you want to be a placer miner which we haven't figured that out here yet. It's too bad because Moosehead obviously had to be our focus because of the history and the results we've given. These are earlier projects, and we weren't really doing them justice. And in this market, if you can get quality partners to advance these projects to the betterment of our shareholders, we get the benefit of enjoying their success as well. So, I mean it's not a loss for us, in fact, I think it's a win for us. It allows us even a sharper focus, on our, obviously our flagship but as well, some of our more district scale things and East Alder and Crippleback were not district scale projects, they were smaller. Whereas Golden Hope is like 3000 claims, now that's a district, Fleur De Lys which is another different beast entirely. We're chasing the biggest Gold deposits in what I call, the Fleur de Lys trend is actually over in Ireland, it's a 6Moz Gold deposit Curraghinalt. Those rocks are identical, I've been there, I've seen these rocks. So I mean, I know what I speak of. I can cherry pick with the best of them but I can back it up with experience. It's always a balance, did you give the farm away with these 2 projects? I don't know, but you know what, we'll still benefit from it through our shareholding and a Royalty and obviously hungry partners.
Matthew Gordon: Okay, so let's talk about that, let's talk about exploration for a second, if you don't mind. I'm buying that's a fundamental component of the story, right? You're trying to do things the right way. So with regards to, now you’ve cash, you have some options, you have some choices about how you spend that cash and the way that you go about your drilling. So, how are you going to go about that job? Because, again, we've seen some stories, in Newfoundland and perhaps they've hit like you with some very high-grade results and they're doing some very small step-outs. They're just being like, I don't know what you call that but it's working, the reaction in the market has been really, really strong to that. How are you going to go about it?
Timothy Froude: Well, we'll do the traditional boot and hammer sort of stuff. These projects clearly are still in early stages, and I'm referring to projects outside of Mooseheads or Fleur De Lys. In fact, we're just beginning work on Fleur De Lys this week. We're going to do a wall-to- wall till sampling programme, which has worked fantastically for all players in this province. Till seems to be the go-to geochemical tool when it comes to defining targets for trenching or drilling or whatever. And so we're going to compile these projects because there's some of them have quite a bit of history, in fact, Golden Hope which is a project we staked along trend from a past producing mine and that was also something I looked at on the map and I said, here's the deposit with past production history and resources of over a 1Moz and it's wide open for staking. The fault that that one sits on is basically the guts of our Golden Hope project and it was available for staking. We staked it for 200k, we have a quality project that if this piece of dirt was in Ontario or Quebec or anywhere else, there'd be hundreds of drill holes on it. You know how many drilled holes around that are done? None, just km from past producing mines. So, even with that staring you in the face, people just never thought that's just a one-off sort of thing, and that's why like I said the rush to Central Newfoundland, yes, was fine. I mean there are other districts with proven histories. In fact, everybody seems to forget that currently, all of the Gold production in Newfoundland comes from the Beaver Peninsula, not Central Newfoundland. So you just look at all of those simple little facts and you're saying, well, you don't need to be in central Newfoundland, we have probably the second best project in Central Newfoundland. So I mean we're fine with that. We also have, it ties up about 8km of the fault structure that you need to be on. We've really only drilled a quarter of that, 2km with visible Gold at each end of that 2km. We still have a lot of work to do here and yeah, did we pass opportunities by for other packages of ground? Well, I'd rather have 8km of what I got than 50km of some of the other stuff over the hill, we'll call it.
Matthew Gordon: But tell me, you got $15M so how are you going to deploy that capital, I get the low G&A etc and the low cost that you've had historically, but you got to advance us this as quickly as possible. And also as makes sense for you to do so I'm intrigued, not just aware, but that the how do you, you've talked about maybe you'll have 3 drill bits going at some point, and you want them turning as many hours of the day as possible, again, at some point, but how in your head are you seeing that being allocated? Where are the drills going? How do you plan it?
Timothy Froude: Well, as I mentioned, in 2018, we started Moosehead with just 1 zone of mineralization. And for those not familiar with the project and any of your listeners, that was what we now call the western trend. It's basically where the predecessor companies had defined a significant number of high-grade hits, but just couldn't sort of tie it all together. So we basically lump that into what we call the western trend. It was called the western trend, because when we first arrived at Moosehead, we drilled the hole and the east side of the Western trend and the rest is history, sort of saying, 11.9m of 45g. So we still have 4 additional zones of mineralization that's open. The plan is to basically step these things out in a responsible way, because as we've seen in the past and not just at Moosehead but as well at Queensway and other projects in Newfoundland. The habits seem to be find something, find the showing, drill the hole underneath it and if you get great results, great, and you step out 50 or 100m sort of saying and these systems as we're now learning, and we always learn with every drill hole, we learn. Geology is not an exact science, it evolves and that's one of the things I love about this business, you learn with every hole. So you have to drill these things on a tighter basis. And that's what seems to be the plan for everyone moving forward is to define these high-grade zones as tightly as you can because you can lose them as quickly as you can pick them up. So what are we going to do? We're going to basically expand in a responsible way all of the known zones we have but as well, we're going to have a drill roving around, I call it the rover to test other areas of the 8km as I mentioned earlier, if the property that we really haven't tested yet that have signs either through geochemistry or just projecting mineralization along trend. In fact, last week, our prospectors came back, basically it was in an area that we've drilled with float that we can't place in an area that's been currently tested. The assays are outstanding on that. This is something that's forthcoming but we may have found float that's attributable to another zone, yet another zone. Are we going to make more discoveries at Moosehead? Yes, we will. We may even make them in the process of defining like the eastern trend and Footwall Splay, these are two zones that basically have a relationship like this, right. So it's hard to drill 2 of them at the same time with a focus, it's complicated. I think people have to realise that you're going to drill holes and get surprises, you're going to drill holes and get disappointments. But I'm pretty confident that at the end of the year with 40 or 50,000m in the bag that we will have expanded all of our zones and I would dare say at least a couple of new discoveries.
Matthew Gordon: Tim, I have enjoyed that as a good conversation. You got to come back on and let us know how you're getting on especially with all this drilling happening. You've got to deliver what you think you're going to be capable of delivering.
Timothy Froude: Yeah, right now, we're about a third of the way through, we could drill probably 15,000m in phase 6 of 50,000m. And again as I mentioned, phase 6 started as 10,000m, it got bumped up to 20, it got bumped up to 50. Phase 6 may go on for years, which I'd like to see happen but maybe we should just stop numbering them and just call them on- going XXXm programmes, right? I'm pretty confident that additional home runs are going to be coming from this project, because we've seen them. Every phase we've drilled we'll get a couple of Bonanza holes or more and like I said, I'll stack our results up with the exception of a couple of holes, yes, I'll give them that. Newfound have certainly hit some home runs, drill holes that I've never seen the likes of in my career and they're rare. And the fact that they're getting them and that we've had some pretty, pretty damn good intersections ourselves. When you're getting into the 200, 300, 500gm/m intercepts I mean, you're talking world class intersections. They just don't happen in isolation, yes, there will be lower-grade holes around it, it has to be. Gold is famous for being nuggety and inconsistent and that's why these things have to be drilled off as carefully as they have been. One of our largest shareholders called me and said, you really need to drill this in very tightly, right? In my experience in the past drilling things tightly as 25m, well that doesn't work for these types of systems. You have to drill them even tighter than that and I think the recipe for success in Newfoundland is now to drill things at 10 to 15m step-outs because you run the risk of missing these things. These things can be very small in terms of their aerial extent, like the Swan Zone at Fosterville, 50m in strike length, 5 to 15m in thickness but they have a plunge and unless you can figure out that plunge, you can drill all the holes you want around it until you get that figured out, you're gonna miss it and I don't want to miss it. It was missed in the past at Moosehead. There were over 100 drill holes at Moosehead before we came along but there was only 1 known zone of mineralization and now we have 5. So we learned from what they did, yes which always helps you, I mean, even the Keat zone, a drill hole in it from the 80s, it's just that the thing was ground at depth and we had a 10% core recovery. So this would be a skinny intersection, take your time with good drillers and you get a good core recovery. Look what they have and I've seen the core, I haven't been on the property, but I've seen their core. You can put Moosehead and Queensway side by side and you would not know the difference. And in fact, at the last PDAC, that you could actually physically attend, Kirkland Lake Gold had a core display from Fosterville, I brought over my box of core for Moosehead laid it down on their table, and they just looked at each other and said, you took that from our core building, didn't you? I mean, these comparisons are real. Obviously, you don't have to have a model but it's nice to have a model but when you have a model, the gem of gems in terms of Gold deposits know how structurally complex in fact, Fosterville, I visited Fosterville, it was nothing mine when I was there 15 years ago. Sometimes it takes a while to figure out these things and find the sweet spots and Swan was only found in the past couple of years. So I like to think that an exploration project shouldn't be killed with a couple of low-grade or blank holes. You have to have patience and persistence and if anything, you won't get this project from me very easily until I've tested it thoroughly.
Matthew Gordon: Tim, I appreciate your time. So thanks very much for coming in.
Timothy Froude: Thank you, Matthew.
Matthew Gordon: Thank you for listening. If you've enjoyed the interview, why not subscribe to cruxcasts or our website cruxinvestor.com and, of course, our YouTube channel crux investor. Plus, you can catch us most days on Twitter and LinkedIn. We really love getting your feedback. So please keep it coming and we'll speak again soon.